Monday, September 11, 2006

Now What?

This video Rachel gave us in 70 pieces doesn't really tell us much.

At least, not much more than we already know. It confirmed that the "numbers" are part of the Valenzetti Equation. An already widely held belief.

Another widely held belief was that the Hanso Foundation was researching the Valenzetti Equation. What we have learned is that they weren't just researching it. They were trying to alter the variables of the Valenzetti Equation to change the outcome of the equation. But something happened. What was it? That is the new question.

22 Comments:

Blogger triskele said...

I had a thought about Matt the Pale's "The Valenzetti Equation is a parlor trick" theory. I said before that I felt obligated to abandon that theory because I didn't like the end game that it played out...but I thought of an ending that I think fits:
The Valenzetti Equation isn't a parlor trick or a self-fulfilling prophecy. Nor is it a prediction of the end of the world. But the equation doesn't work, either. It is essentially an unsolvable problem.
The ultimate goal of the Valenzetti Equation is to occupy the best scientific minds in the world with figuring it out so that they would not develop more and better weapons of mass destruction. he wanted to siphon the brain power out of the weapons-building programs and into the relatively harmless Equation-solving programs. No government (or business for that matter) would voluntarily move their best weapons-building minds into an area of, as Valenzetti would see it, peace-building...there needs to be a pay off. The stated pay off, the one to be used to justify the cost, is the date of the end of humankind; the real pay off is sending the weapons programs on a wild goose chase that prevents more WMDs from being made, and promotes peace by distraction.
Let me know what you think.

9/11/2006 8:22 PM  
Blogger vexingmodstwo said...

A very interesting theory, Triskele...

In your scenario, did Hanso know this or did he too get "distracted" and put all that money into the Dharma Initiative?

I guess, the question is:

Who's goal was this? Valenzetti's or Hanso's?

9/12/2006 7:28 AM  
Blogger Matt the Pale said...

Triskele: If that's the case, Valenzetti failed miserably. No governments know about the Valenzetti Equation -- ostensibly, the only people who know about it are those at the Hanso Foundation -- and are therefore unable to waste their money on it. Scientists are being forced by the Hanso Foundation to work on the Equation. And not only that, but the Hanso Foundation is using the Equation to justify not only the starting of wars and other troubles in the world, but the creation of better weapons of mass destruction, as we have proof of a biological weapon from the Sri Lanka Video.

It's plain for me to see that the "relatively harmless Equation-solving programs" aren't so relatively harmless after all.

9/12/2006 7:44 AM  
Blogger vexingmodstwo said...

I think Triskele's theory might hold some insight...

Your rebuttal may still fit into the overall theory.

It just depends on whether the "distraction" strategy was Valenzetti's or Hanso's.

9/12/2006 7:51 AM  
Blogger eekalicious said...

Matt- keep in mind that the current incarnation of the Hanso foundation appears to be under Mittlewerk's control and not Alvar's. We have no way of knowing if and/or when there was a shift in purpose or execution (no pun int).

I think the idea that the VE is a "trick" or a "distraction" is in keeping with Valenzetti's personality. However, there had to have been SOME tangible results over time to make the scientists and others working on it continue. You can't spend THAT long working variables of an equation with absolutely no results.

Right? ;-)

9/12/2006 8:16 AM  
Blogger vexingmodstwo said...

Belly you sneaky lurker you.

9/12/2006 8:23 AM  
Blogger triskele said...

Enzo Valenzetti: I believe that this is his wild goose chase. He computed it, created it, used it to trick the U.N., and went into hiding to force others to sove it. Sort of like Data plugging the unsolvable algorithm into the Borg to get them to stop their attack. He wanted all of the governments to work together to solve his equation. This cooperation was the first step in getting them to stop fighting. He didn't foresee Hanso hiding the equation. To his mind, solving this would have to be a global effort.

Alvar Hanso: I have said before and I repeat that it is my belief that he had a Road to Damascus moment. Like Alfred Nobel, who after seeing the destructive power he unleashed in dynamite, decided to leave a better mark on the world and created the Nobel prizes, Alvar Hanso was attempted to exorcize the weapons-merchant demons by starting the DHARMA Intitiative. I think he believed in the equation and was seeking to use it to change humanity for the better. Something failed, something changed inside the D.I.
a) a coup d'etat by one of the deGroots, by The Others, by Him, I don't know who.
b) maybe Hanso learned the truth of the equation, and dispirited, he went into seclusion.
c) Mittelwerk wrested control from Hanso, who was too absorbed in his goodwill project to see that the rest of the company was being taken away from him.

Thomas Mittelwerk: Saw the usefulness of the equation in a more Machiavellian light. I think he still thinks that he is trying to save the world, but he sees any amount of collateral damage as incidental and worth the cost. He thought that Alvar's peacful, means were not strong enough to create any change in the Numbers, and is engineering a virus to try changing the world's population. He is perhaps made more evil by the fact that he doesn't realize that he is doing evil. He thinks that evil justified because it serves good ends (Machiavelli). Like Hitler did.

In the sense that Valenzetti stopped at least one major weapons manufacturer, he succeeded. I still don't get how a project funded by the U.N. could be so completely lost to the whole world, but then I am continually surprised by the incompetence of governments.

9/12/2006 8:32 AM  
Blogger vexingmodstwo said...

I'm warming up to this theory, Triskele.

9/12/2006 8:38 AM  
Blogger ashleebear said...

Trisk--I agree with your theory on most levels, particularly on the possible motives of Valenzetti & Alvar Hanso. I'm bothered by one point though--who then, besides Valenzetti himself--was aware that the equation is essentially a red herring? If it's simply a device to bring governments together and destract them from destroying each other, I can understand that V would've kept the true nature of the equation a secret. So did things start to get out of hand after his disappearance, or did he see where things were heading & that's why he dropped of the face of the earth?

RE: Mittelwerk. Again, I totally agree that his motives are essentially Machiavellian, and that he likely believes he is working toward a justified "end." But are we to see him then as a tragic figure, destroying lives in the service of an ideal that is founded on a fabrication? It makes my head spin a little.

9/12/2006 8:55 AM  
Blogger triskele said...

ashleebear--he had to drop off of the face of the earth to get his plan to work. Governments are a very lazy bunch, and rather than try to solve it for themselves would just attempt to coerce Valenzetti into giving them the answer. He had to hide to force themt o work together.

TWM--the complicated people are the most compelling.

9/12/2006 8:59 AM  
Blogger eekalicious said...

Nothing has so far shown that Valenzetti created the equation with the purpose of being able to change the outcome. I was under the impression that was Alvar's doing...

I agree that Mittlewerk believes he is doing the right thing. You can hear that emotion in his voice...

9/12/2006 9:08 AM  
Blogger DharmaChick said...

I think that an old comment by BroadbandBeatnik may actually apply to the VE, but we just didn't know it at the time:

"I believe there is a Japanese mouse in this building. The kind that's been through the maze so many times, it lost track of its original purpose. And now instead of working of the greater good of humanity, the experiment has turned on itself and the Laws of Nature have been torn to shreds..."

9/12/2006 9:12 AM  
Blogger vexingmodstwo said...

Wow DC, very nice...

9/12/2006 9:15 AM  
Blogger eekalicious said...

Good point Dharmachick!

9/12/2006 9:16 AM  
Blogger eekalicious said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

9/12/2006 9:18 AM  
Blogger maven said...

Very interesting thoughts. It has always been surprising to me that the VE was never "big news" when it came out in the 1960's. (You would think that TPTB would have planted something here and there. LOL) I know it was supposedly surpressed by the UN and eventually THF, but something would have leaked out. Anyway, if this VE was supposed to keep the world's scientists busy so they wouldn't devlop WMDs, the supression of the equation would have nixed that idea. I also know that having "doomsday" out there for the general public would cause panic (the "Cold War" was doing a good job of that also), but the scientific community would have been able to work on it quietly. But since the UN and THF supressed it, the VE wouldn't have been "busy work" for the scientific community.

9/12/2006 9:20 AM  
Blogger ashleebear said...

DC--Wow, nice connection! I'd forgotten about that reference, but it seems to square nicely!

9/12/2006 9:20 AM  
Blogger maven said...

Good connection, dharmachick! That points out how this whole thing had spun out of control.

9/12/2006 9:25 AM  
Blogger DharmaChick said...

Another possible hint that may have fallen through the cracks...

The old Dj Dan reference to a "Conspiracy masquerading as a hoax" has always stuck with me because I felt that it must apply to something important along the way, even though it was casually thrown in at the beginning:

"FRANK: War of the Worlds radio broadcast?

DJ DAN: Oooh, Frank. You little devil. Tonya, my producer at large, what’s your take on that?

TONYA: Hoax.

DJ DAN: WRONG! Conspiracy masquerading as a hoax. That was, what, ah, 1938 Frank?

FRANK: Ahh, don’t know. (?)

DJ DAN: SHUTDOWN! It WAS 1938. The first color photos of Mars had just come in and, shock of shocks, the thing looks like a “frackin” Christmas tree. Nothing but red rocks and green heads. Now the US government alien agenda doesn’t want a real panic, so what do they do? They get Orson Welles to do War of the Worlds, get it? They cause a fake panic, expose it as a hoax, and everything goes back to normal. A couple years later, when the pictures do leak, everybody thinks it’s another hoax, but that’s the truth. And Welles uses alien film making technology to make 'Citizen Kane', you heard it here first folks. Next caller…"

I posted this a while ago at the Fuselage at this post:
http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=54580

but could it possibly have implications in terms of the VE?

9/12/2006 9:52 AM  
Blogger Dennis said...

If the Valenzetti equation is a FAKE:

All of the research that was being done to change the variable isn't working? Why? Because the numbers can't be changed. It is all a scam being perpetrated by Enzo, Alvar, and the UN, to pacify the US and USSR. Alvar sets up this phony foundation to "solve" the equation that he knows can never be solved. The end date is a long way off so they can worry about that later, plus there might be some good that comes out of it.

Fast forward 40+ years, no progress had been made on the equation, and some people who are not in the know, like Mittelwerk, start to worry that something drastic needs to be done. So he starts wars, creates viruses, etc. trying to change the equation...and it still doesn't change the “numbers”. The only two people alive that know the truth are Alvar and Enzo, but Ezno is missing or dead. So Alvar has to go into hiding because he can’t admit to lying all these years, and he is afraid of Mittelwerk and what he is doing.

Under this scenario, Rachel Blake still gets to be the good guy. She can stop Mittelwerk AND the world won’t come to an end. Even Mittelwerk gets a little redemption, since he didn’t know the equation was fake. Especially if all those people in Sri Lanka can still be saved.

Alvar turns out to be a good guy overall, but a failure by letting things get out of hand. Maybe Alvar has been trying to track down Ezno since 2001, and that's why he hasn't been seen...

There's no reason why Rachel couldn't find Alvar, Enzo, or both. Maybe this DJ Dan meeting is with Alvar, and together they will go find Ezno. They don't really need Enzo to reveal the truth, but since he discovered the equation, he would be the best person to disprove it.

Also, maybe the last two Gary Troup interviews reveal that he doesn't believe the equation is real. That would explain why Alvar bought up all the books.

9/12/2006 10:53 AM  
Blogger triskele said...

dennis--I like your thoughts! But I still think that Alvar believed in the equation. At least to begin with.

9/12/2006 11:58 AM  
Blogger capcom said...

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing I know, I only watch math shows on TV, but is there such a thing as an unsolvable or unchangable equation? (mathemeticians, please don't shoot milk out your nose too hard!)
Maybe EV's equation is one of those, if possible? Otherwise, if the equation was legit, I find it hard to believe that NOTHING in the equation could be changed at all, one way or another, for better or worse. It seems like you would at least be able to change it in a bad way, i.e., make doomsday come sooner. An "oops" factor, if you will. :-)

9/12/2006 6:14 PM  

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